What do you guys think about this? I think it's terrible. - Page 4

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  • #189155
    Mary 2496
    Member

    This has been irritating me more and more because it’s a discredit to the accounting profession.

    Someone that I know very well just graduated with a degree in accounting. S/he gained employment with a local, very large and well-known public accounting firm. For the first four months of employment, this person was given the “task” of passing the CPA exam. S/he would sit in their assigned office all day, for eight hours, and do nothing but study even though they were on company time. Okay – sounds great. Because this is the person’s only “job,” s/he passes the exams quite quickly (in about a five or six month period).

    S/he has zero professional experience in accounting. I know this for a fact. After s/he passes the exam, one of the CPA’s in the same office signs off on that person’s paperwork so that the license can be issued for this person. The CPA fills out the necessary areas and states that the applicant has more than two years of experience. (It is one to two years experience depending on education level achieved, per Ohio law.)

    I was really disappointed at this, not because the person was issued a license, but because this is really a well-respected CPA practice nationwide. I was a bit upset that they’d downplay the profession like this, so to speak, as the firm is known for its commitment to sound ethical practices.

    Any thoughts?

Viewing 15 replies - 46 through 60 (of 79 total)
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  • #612332
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I'm not trying to stir the Kool-Aid here but I saw this thread about 30 minutes after I found out some information that frankly pisses me off! So the Ragin' Cajun is out of her box and standing on top of it right now.

    1. This isn't about minding your own business. This is about discrediting the profession as a whole. All it takes is a handful of unethical people and BOOM it's Enron and Arthur Anderson all over again. It diminishes the creditability of everyone in the field. Now I'm not walking around with rose colored glasses on, I know that people do stupid stuff all the time. But ultimately we will all suffer for it because we won't get to charge as much per billable hour if the whole country thinks we are all just looking out for ourselves and not really interested in protecting the public good. A few years ago, there was a big scandal at a university in Louisiana where some guy in the Registrars office was basically granting degrees for a price. If I remember correctly $30k would get you a Bachelors in Education and $60k would get you a Masters. One school board had to fire 1/3 of their teaching staff because their degrees were fake. Now, I know several people who went to that school and got their degrees legitimately. Do you think that this scandal didn't affect them? If so, think again. One of them lost her job even though she provided her transcripts and quite a few of the exams that she took. It didn't matter. There was a stigma associated with that school and there will be for a long time to come.

    2. There are unethical people in every field. What I found out about 30 minutes ago, is that the four zero's that I was so proud of a few months ago, turned out to not be completely factual. It was more like 3 zero's and a damn 85! I was told by my doctor, a very respected endocrinologist, that my x-ray's were normal and there was no sign of the cancer metastisizing to any other organ or the bone. What I found out, once I finally got online access to my lab reports is that the x-ray wasn't quite that clean. There are several spots on my spleen. So I called the doctor's office and I was told “those really aren't big enough to worry about yet.” WTF!! When do I start to worry about them? When I'm in so much pain I can't stand up straight? When I can't stop throwing up? During my autopsy? When!?!? I should have been told as soon as she knew it. The x-ray was the scary test for me because one of the forms of cancer that I was diagnosed with doesn't respond to the normal treatment and that's the one I freaking failed!

    3. Some people can take all of the ethics courses and ethics exams that are required and they will still make unethical decisions. Ethics isn't something that, in my opinion, can be taught. You are either an ethical person with a conscience or you are a dipsh!t that should be required to wear a sign around your neck, a Scarlet E perhaps.

    4. If someone knows this type of thing is going on and can prove it, then you might want to make sure you aren't required to report it. You wouldn't want to jeopardize your own license for someone else.

    The Ragin' Cajun is back in her box with the lid firmly attached. I'm still fuming mad but I'll shut up for now.

    #612333
    Tripp11
    Member

    If it were me, I would send a letter to the Ohio State Board of Accountancy and let them know about this “alleged” ethics breach if you feel strongly about the matter and you believe what you've been told.

    AUD - 93
    BEC - 80
    REG - 86
    FAR - 83

    #612334
    Mary 2496
    Member

    Thanks everyone —

    @ Rocky – Thanks for the compliment about my discussion posts, Rocky.

    @ Kricket – Exactly. I feel the same and it is totally angering. On another note, my sympathies on the news you received. I an a twelve-year cancer survivor. I had a rare type of cancer that also required specialized treatment. My prayers and thoughts are with you.

    @ Tripp – I have REG on Monday but am seriously considering putting a letter together and doing exactly what you suggested.

    #612335
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I don't know what you should, and I'm not going to recommend anything.

    I think you should think carefully though what might result from your actions, and if you're willing to go through the consequences.

    E.g. are you prepared to lose your job? Are you prepared to hire a lawyer?

    Do you have a backup plan if any of those possible outcomes happen? Make sure you really want something before you do it. Otherwise, you're going to possibly end up in a scenario where you don't really have the drive or passion to pursue anything, because you realize you actually didn't value something that much.

    Also, hire a lawyer no matter what first. What if you were wrong about what you saw? What if the person had previous experience before the job? Or what if you're right, but there's a better way of doing things to ensure that justice is delivered.

    Please talk to a lawyer first, and acknowledge that you're considering a potentially big decision.

    #612336
    Rocky123
    Member

    I agree with what Akvod said. Talk to a lawyer before you do ANYTHING. Lots of things to consider.

    The tallest oak in the forest was once just a little nut that held its ground.

    AUD-PASS
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    Rocky123, CPA

    #612337
    Mary 2496
    Member

    I will take your suggestions into consideration.

    In regards to your comments,

    – I can't get fired from my firm, I run it. (not always too happy about that, either!)

    – This is an extended family member. I know for a fact that this person has zero accounting experience other than obtaining a college degree in accounting.

    Thanks – I will definitely consider the legal aspects of it.

    #612338
    nicole2035
    Member

    You wont' be just challenging the extended family member but the cpa firm, the cpa that signed off on the hours etc.

    idk what to think about your post because few details, i'm not even sure if you're a troll or not. just write an anonymous letter to the board, problem solved, even make it anonymous email or phone call…

    #612339
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    – So then what if the person in question directly sues you (because I'm assuming you're that person's employer)? Or do you mean figuratively? If that person in question has favoritism, and the other people aren't rational, you could still lose your job. Anything can happen. At best, there may be politicking.

    – Even worse. Now it's not office politics, but family drama.

    Again, consider the legal aspects, consider the ethical aspects, and I personally believe it's good to always consider personal/egotisical values. That's not to say those should factor into your decision, but it could help you 1) understand the scales of your actions and prepare you for them 2) plan the specific actions you're going to take to minimize unwanted consequences.

    E.g. if you want to not have family drama, is there a way to do this quietly? Or if it's not possible to do it quietly, you could first talk to other family members and hold a family meeting, I don't know. I can't really give you advice, even if I had more information.

    Which is all the reason why you should talk with a trusted lawyer and adviser. Please don't make a snap decision.

    #612340
    Mary 2496
    Member

    lol … no, not a troll. Just a public accountant trying to pass the CPA exam and this issue happen to come up, so I decided to ask you fine folks. That's all. 🙂

    – To clarify – no, this person does not work for me. This is an extended family member that works for a large public accounting firm that is known for its upstanding work ethics, nationwide. I am the CEO of our public accounting firm, which is totally separate from theirs. The only connection my firm has to theirs is that once in a great while, when we get too overloaded with audits or other types of work, we refer out to them. (Not any longer, after this.)

    – I can't get fired. I am the boss. I really like the idea of speaking with an attorney, though. Trying to finish the exam while this is going on, and I hadn't even thought of that. Super busy at work. Just finished corp extensions and now individual extensions are due. Reg on Monday, thinking I will seek legal advice after I get through REG next week. Thanks everyone!

    #612341
    NYCaccountant
    Participant

    @Mary 2496 But why does it matter so much? Why even write an anonymous letter to board? or consult with an attorney?

    What were the circumstances in this situation?

    AUD - 99
    BEC - 84
    FAR - 93
    REG - 87
    NYC born and raised.

    FAR - 93
    REG - 87
    BEC - 84!!!!
    AUD - 99!!!!!! CPA exam complete.

    #612342
    Mary 2496
    Member

    @ NYC

    My firm is a public accounting firm, which I now run. This firm that I am talking about is a well-known public accounting firm that boasts about their clean, shining ethical practices and in fact, even lectures around the country on ethical practices in public accounting. We have referred clients to this firm, as this firm offers services to issuers, but we don't.

    Because I know of their reputation and how much they pride themselves on purely ethical practices and sound decision-making throughout their firm, it royally pissed me off once I found out this happened. (Sorry to be blunt.) I stopped all referrals to the firm where this happened. I know this happened, as the person who works for this firm and that this involved in an extended family member and I know for a fact that s/he has no accounting experience at all.

    Because of their prided reputation, I couldn't believe this took place. It just burned me that this is the type of behavior going on there, behind closed doors. I felt like every ethical lecture that they have given has been a sham.

    #612343
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Well, it's ultimately a matter of value judgment, and even if we had all the facts, you're the one who has to make the call.

    So my only recommendation to you is to make sure

    1) You're not going in this alone. Have a trusted adviser with you, preferably a lawyer.

    2) With your trusted adviser, lay out the possibilities, options, and outcomes, meanwhile collecting more information

    3) Organize everything you did in 2, and be very hard and pessimistic. Will you really be willing to accept the outcome if it goes south for you? Are you willing to say, deal with lawyers, office politics, and family drama while you're taking the CPA exam?

    Again, it's a matter of what your ethical and other personal values are. Just make sure that you make an informed decision that is in line with your values, and I think another trusted adviser can really help make sure you're looking at things in perspective. And don't rush this process too.

    #612344
    Mary 2496
    Member

    Thanks, I do appreciate all of the advice given here.

    #612345
    tomq04
    Participant

    Give 'em the screws! Protects the whole crew of us.

    REG- (1) 76
    FAR- (2) 64, (5)74, (7)83 (Over achiever!)
    AUD- (3) 70, (4) 75
    BEC- (6) 75

    #612346
    TiffaNiffaNi
    Member

    I am also in Ohio. The experience requirement here is not very specific…My only concern would be that it must be absolutely certain that no one else (outside of that firm) certified the experience. For instance, is it possible that your relative had been doing work on the side? Taxes or some form of bookkeeping/financial statement prep?

    If the person graduated with a Master's degree, one year of experience is sufficient and can be obtained from multiple sources (a month here, 4 months there, etc.). Likewise, the direct supervisor does NOT have to be a CPA…

    FAR: 7/17/14- 79
    AUD: 8/20/14- 91
    REG: 10/1/14- 88
    BEC: 11/10/14- 85

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