Changing from W2 employee to contractor - Page 2

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    Topic
  • #1692166
    sacpa
    Participant

    Please bear with me, it’s a long post.

    Though my background in not in Accounting, I met the education requirements for the CPA exam & got qualified to take the exam. I have an A in all my Accounting courses. I have not passed any section yet.

    I have worked as seasonal Tax Preparer in CPA firms from 2013 – 2017. As a W2 employee, I started with an hourly pay of $17/hr. Then $20, $25, $29.32 last year. Except for the last job which I got through Accountemps, the rest of them were from Craislist ads to which I directly responded & got selected. In 2013, I also worked for 3 months as an Account Executive while I handled A/R, A/P, bank reconciliations & used QuickBooks.

    Currently, I have been offered a contract position in an Accounting firm for 6 months. One partner is a CPA & the other is not. During the tax season, I will be preparing taxes 15 – 22 hours per week & paid $25/hr. After tax season, it will be Financial Accounting & bookkeeping duties working for 10 – 15 hours per week & pay will be $22/hr. After 6 months, if all goes well & they are impressed, they may offer a job as a W2 employee, which off course is not guaranteed.

    Pros:
    1. The work hours would be ideal since I can balance both work & studying for the CPA exam.
    2. The firm is about 10 minutes away from my home so no long commute. However, when I start the bookkeeping duties, I might need to commute to clients’ firms.
    3. I will learn a lot while preparing taxes & especially bookkeeping which I love to learn & gain more experience.
    4. I can claim expenses as a contractor in my tax return. I am covered by my husband’s health insurance, so that is not an issue.
    5. I may be offered a job as a full time W2 employee, if the employer is impressed with me.

    Cons:
    1. Pay as contract tax preparer is lower than I made as a W2 employee. As a contractor, I need to pay employer’s share of 6.2% social security taxes (in CA), 1.45% of Medicare taxes in addition to the employee’s share.

    Given the above situation, I would love to hear your thoughts & suggestions as to whether taking this contract position is a good idea. Any other valid points that I did not mention are very appreciated. Thanks in advance.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

Viewing 15 replies - 16 through 30 (of 45 total)
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  • #1692347
    sacpa
    Participant

    ReckedRacing: I am in CA.

    MrsEarlaRiopel: At the end of the day, that is what matters. What I earn after all the taxes & properly filing tax return. I have never worked as a Contractor & all the responses are encouraging me to look into this further. Thanks for your wishes!

    Tim: What a score in FAR! Any tips for FAR &/or links to your posts with tips?

    Aaron: Awesome score in AUD. I am currently reviewing AUD & planning to take it soon. Any tips for AUD &/or links to your posts with tips?

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1692370
    Missy
    Participant

    One more factor to consider, should they decide to part ways with you the income earned as a 1099 contractor in most cases won't count towards earnings used to calculate unemployment benefits (at least in MA, could be different in CA)

    Old timer,  A71'er since 2010.

    Finance manager/HR manager

     

     

    Licensed Massachusetts Non Reporting CPA since 2012
    Finance/Admin/HR Manager

    #1692371
    sacpa
    Participant

    Thanks for bringing that up, Missy!

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1692446
    jenpen
    Participant

    So to add something new I just learned today: if you're working as a contractor that would go on a schedule C I'm assuming for your taxes. In the new tax law there is a qualified business income deduction that could be applied to reduce your tax bill. The examples I got in the seminar today looked good and could save a lot of money. It would go against whatever income you claim on the schedule C only and wouldn't reduce your AGI, but your taxable income after the standard deduction.

    AUD - 85
    BEC - 84
    FAR - 82
    REG - 78
    Ethics - 95
    Licensed in IL & MO

    AUD - 56 - 68 - 61 - 9/8/16
    REG - 75
    FAR - 7/15/16
    BEC - TBD

    Wiley CPAexcel and NINJA 10 Point Combo

    #1692491
    CPAwannab
    Participant

    Another factor to consider is “at risk” issue. If you are going to be independent contractor you are fully responsible and liable for your work. If you make mistake and f.e. file tax return incorectly are you liable for potential interest and penalties? are you ready to take that risk? if your firm is taking all that risk, then you are 100% employee and hiring you as an independent contractor is illegal. I'm sure they know it, and that proves that ethics in our profession is indeed an issue.

    Ps. The new business deduction is 20% taken on second page on your 1040. It does not reduce your SE tax, rather it's 20% deduction on your Schedule C bottom line (After considering SE). Great news for small business owners.

    BEC 79

    FAR 78

    AUD 88

    REG 83

    #1692503
    sacpa
    Participant

    Jennifer & CPAwannab:
    Yes, the new Tax bill is favorable for small business owners.

    CPAwannab: Good point about liability issues. I will look into the contract regarding this issue. I do know that the employer will be reviewing & filing them.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1692875
    aaronmo
    Participant

    Audit just made sense to me…it's also the only accounting course I had at a 4 year program, and it was the class I had closest to starting the exam prep, so it might reflect that too. I worked less on Audit than I did the other sections.

    Honestly the exams are far enough in the rear view that I don't really remember it anymore. I remember the test computer crashing 4 times during REG…I remember getting dozens of IFRS questions on FAR, when I deliberately went light on IFRS…and that's about it.

    AUD - 96
    BEC - 84
    FAR - 89
    REG - 86
    Aaron and always remember, YMMV

    I profit from your CPE frustration. You're welcome.

    #1693514
    sacpa
    Participant

    Thanks for your response, Aaron!

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1727953
    sacpa
    Participant

    In spite of your insightful responses warning me about the contractor position & my gut feelings, I went ahead & signed the contract. Though I knew I was stepping down as far as pay is concerned, I felt that I could learn a lot, gain more experience preparing corporate returns & doing bookkeeping & at the same time I can study for the CPA exam even during tax season with short commute & working less hours.

    Till the day I joined, I was given the impression that the CPA firm occupied the whole suite. There were 2-3 front desk people. While waiting in the lobby, I could see a big conference room since it had a glass wall. The first interview was conducted in a room which I assumed was the office of the non CPA partner who interviewed me. When I even asked whether it is a paperless office, the partner showed the desk & room & said yes, it is a paperless office. She did say that their firm is a boutique firm. The 2nd interview when the CPA joined the non CPA partner, was conducted in a smaller conference room (different room than the one I saw from the lobby). Imagine my surprise when I found out the 1st day of work that the CPA firm is a one room office in a shared suite. There is a bigger desk which is mainly used by the non CPA partner who comes to office almost everyday & shared with the CPA partner who comes for a few hours 1 or 2 days in a week & mostly works remote. Another smaller desk is used by a part time employee. There are only 3 chairs in the room & if all 4 of us are working at the office, they had to borrow a chair from another office.

    During the 2nd interview, I was told that they plan to pay $20/hr. I explained to them that that was my pay during my 2nd tax season & that I am not a beginner. The next day they sent me the contract with pay of $25 for tax preparation & $22 for bookkeeping, which is when I posted here asking for suggestions. With my own research, I found that to convert W2 hourly pay to contractor hourly pay, the latter should be more since we have to pay self employment taxes. Since I am covered by my husband's firm, health insurance was not a big deal & I did not consider that into the equation. So in addition to uneasy feeling due to the contract terms mentioned in my original post & the low pay they offered, I felt I was at a disadvantage. Yet I signed the contract due to above mentioned reasons.

    The other thing that is of concern is that even before the 1st day, I was given directions as to which day & time to report. Since they had not installed the needed things in the laptop they were going to give me on the 1st day I started, I was told to come the following Tuesday at 10:30. So basically they get to tell me the time & day I was supposed to come to work which is what an employer does to his/her employees. Independent contractor status & pay but employee work terms.

    My very 2nd corporate return I was given was a complicated one. The clients' expenses were not itemized properly. The expenses for each category was given on a monthly basis instead of annual basis. Plus, the client had left off some expenses, so reconciliation could not be done. The non CPA partner took over & then rearranged the expenses, prepared a pivot table, then added the expenses paid by debit card to the expenses paid by checks & just as I found out, some expenses were left out by the client. So during my work review, I was told that it was a simple return & it took only 1 hour for the partner to complete it. This was after she had got all the information from the client who had to be told twice that the expenses had to be properly itemized & total annual expenses had to be provided. Even then the client itemized the expenses but did not convert them to annual basis for each category. They said that due to learning curve, 2 hours would be reasonable for me to complete it & not anything more than that. The same happened with another return due to other complications. Personally I feel that 2 hours would not be enough to go through the prior return, do reconciliation, send emails to partner about the itemization issue, read the responses, go through the updated documents from the client & then lastly complete the return. So today I was grilled by both partners during my performance review. Though the whole discussion was on a decent level, I still felt like I was treated like dirt or worse. But the whole time I managed to stay calm in explaining my situation, asked questions about the returns & pointed out some liabilities that were left out & tax preparation fees added to taxes in the return completed by the partner.

    Also, the non partner mentioned that the job does not involve mere data entries but work with understanding of what needs to be done. While I also agreed to that, I mentioned that the contract had included making data entries in the job description for tax preparer, to which the non CPA partner replied that she is an authority in preparing contracts & that there is nothing wrong in mentioning data entries contradicting to what she said as her expectation.

    With this kind of a stifling atmosphere with a bossy partner who argues for the smallest things, tries to manipulate the situation, having double standards, I really don't feel like continuing. I am planning to prove myself by preparing a complicated corporate return even if the clients documents are messy & then given notice tot the firm. On the other hand, I can stick it out for the whole 6 months of contract time & then leave. But I am not sure I can take it for 6 months.

    Sorry for the long post. Appreciate your suggestions & feedback.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1727975
    turo9992000
    Participant

    I'm sorry that your experience has not been positive. It seems like they are looking for short term people. Learn what you can, study and find a firm that will help you grow.

    Do you know what their prices are for the returns? Are they comparable to the competition?

    AUD - 64, 80 Passed on 10/09/17

    BEC - 75 Passed on 12/09/17

    FAR - 69, 71, 73, 83 Passed on 06/10/18

    REG - 81 Passed on 09/10/17

    #1727999
    sacpa
    Participant

    @turo9992000: Thanks for your response. It depends on the quantity of work & complexity of the return. For a simple corporate return, it's around $300. They are paying me by the hour not by return. Hope that answers your question.

    Basically I want to know whether I am at fault & whether the firm is right. I have prepared lot of corporate returns in a previous position, but nothing complicated. For the same reason, I did not have any problem while reconciling. While I understand that I am expected to do complicated returns, having such high expectation of completing in 2 hours seems a tall order. Don't get me wrong, I do want to learn doing any king of complicated return & not complaining about being assigned tough work.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1728004
    CPAwannab
    Participant

    I am sorry you are dealing with work environment like this. First off, you are a 100% employee and what they do is simply illegal. Being CPA firm where ethics should be big part of the business, I would run form there ASAP. Good luck!

    BEC 79

    FAR 78

    AUD 88

    REG 83

    #1728029
    sacpa
    Participant

    @CPAwannab: Thank you for your response & wishes! They are taking advantage of my with all these terms. But as far as work is concerned, the CPA is very particular that everything is in proper order. Can't say that they are not ethical as far as work is concerned, as far as I know.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

    #1728076
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    The IRS guidelines make it very obvious that the contractor classification is really intended for licensed professionals and people running their own business. However, I think your case is debatable because you do perform the work of a CPA.

    If things don't work out, you can always contact the state and/or IRS later (I forget which) and get your FICA overpayments refunded (if they do determine that you were not a contractor). Which will also subject your former employer to a nice inquiry from the EDD auditors.

    #1728354
    sacpa
    Participant

    There is a clause in the contract which says that if it is determined that the independent contractor is an employee, then the contractor is responsible for paying all taxes, assessments & penalties imposed against the contractor or firm in addition to penalties deducted from the contractor earnings if the contractor was on payroll & employed as an employee.

    I should have gone with my gut feeling in the beginning itself avoiding this whole messy situation.

    Winners don't quit. Quitters don't win.

    FAR - < than 75, 10/2013, 2/2015
    BEC - < than 75, 10/2013
    AUD - < than 75, 8/2015, 1/2016

    ~ Winners fail until they succeed. Losers quit when they fail. - Robert Kiyosaki
    ~ I survived because the fire inside burned brighter than the fire around me.
    ~ Something will grow from all you are going through. And it will be YOU.
    ~ Right now you may not be where you intend to be, but it's where you need to be in order to get where you want to go.

Viewing 15 replies - 16 through 30 (of 45 total)
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