[Anonymous]

During the first presentation of my audit entry class, a senior manager accidentally plugged in his computer to the overhead with a document titled “termination of managers.”

Does the big four fire individuals as high as manager to keep spaces open for the promotion schedule? Hence, “up or out.”

I always thought if you were decent, you could always just stay put at your current level of you wanted…forever.

[Mayo]

“Does the big four fire individuals as high as manager to keep spaces open for the promotion schedule? Hence, “up or out.”

I always thought if you were decent, you could always just stay put at your current level of you wanted…forever.”

I find that presentation you mentioned quite odd. Manager and Sr. Manager level is often the most understaffed level due to the deep lay offs during the 2008-2009 years. I personally have never seen a Manager get fired. Usually, bad apples are normally let go in Staff or Senior level.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[fuzyfro89]

True mass layoffs (as in entire groups of people) are uncommon except for if an office loses a big client (or several) which makes their staffing in the short term no longer viable. This tends to be in small/mid sized offices, but even large ones can be affected.

If the business hit was too large, then yes, they would lay people off. In reality, at least some people would do one of the following:
– be reassigned internally & locally
– be reassigned internally but not locally (temporary)
– be reassigned internally but not locally (permanent relocations)
– quit and go work at the newly hired firm (e.g. EY to PWC) as they now need experts in a new industry/client and can't staff a big new client immediately

Big 4 is up or out through senior manager level (unless you go part time). At senior manager level and above, there are no more strict timelines, but if your leadership does not believe you want and are not capable of moving up, then eventually they will make that known and you will either quit on your own accord (assuming you disagree and do want to move up), or they may find a way for you to stay if you are a good performer (not common, but I've seen it happen).

At the staff/senior associate/manager levels, people are typically shown the door if they don't get promoted. Generally, this comes in the form of 2 consecutive semi-annual reviews which are negative and you do not improve.

[Mayo]

@fuzyfro89,

“Big 4 is up or out through senior manager level (unless you go part time). At senior manager level and above, there are no more strict timelines, but if your leadership does not believe you want and are not capable of moving up, then eventually they will make that known and you will either quit on your own accord (assuming you disagree and do want to move up), or they may find a way for you to stay if you are a good performer (not common, but I've seen it happen).”

I've seen this happen at the Sr Manager level, but it's usually a lot less negative than a simple layoff. Usually a partner or two wil have a sit down with the Sr. Manager and basically say, “look, based on XYZ, you probably won't make partner”. But then I've seen partners actively help to try and find a place for the Sr. Manager. Which is a big boost. Obviously, it's self serving in a lot of ways, but at least it's better than a simple pink slip.

The other option is to become an Exec Director. Which is like a Sr Manager with higher pay and a lot of times in a specialist sort of field. Think Employee Benefit Plan specialists (which no one wants to be). But these usually mean your career progression basically dies unless you leave the firm.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Mayo]

@fuzyfro89,

“Big 4 is up or out through senior manager level (unless you go part time). At senior manager level and above, there are no more strict timelines, but if your leadership does not believe you want and are not capable of moving up, then eventually they will make that known and you will either quit on your own accord (assuming you disagree and do want to move up), or they may find a way for you to stay if you are a good performer (not common, but I've seen it happen).”

I've seen this happen at the Sr Manager level, but it's usually a lot less negative than a simple layoff. Usually a partner or two wil have a sit down with the Sr. Manager and basically say, “look, based on XYZ, you probably won't make partner”. But then I've seen partners actively help to try and find a place for the Sr. Manager. Which is a big boost. Obviously, it's self serving in a lot of ways, but at least it's better than a simple pink slip.

The other option is to become an Exec Director. Which is like a Sr Manager with higher pay and a lot of times in a specialist sort of field. Think Employee Benefit Plan specialists (which no one wants to be). But these usually mean your career progression basically dies unless you leave the firm.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Author]

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