[Amanda]

I posted about something similar before and didn’t get responses but now I have a more specific question, since what I anticipated actually happened.

I live in Colorado. I haven taken 3 of the 4 exams in Colorado (still have 1 left to take). For the most part, I plan to continue living in Colorado.

However, I just quit a job, and my boss will not sign off on my hours because she’s mad about me leaving and I think is trying to hold it over my head so I eventually come back – who knows.

Anyway, I have done work for other CPAs – not 1800 hours though, like Colorado requires – just some freelance work. There are some states that allow you to have ANY CPA sign off on your hours, not necessarily a coworker or boss (e.g. Washington and Montana). They do NOT require you to be a resident. They just require that the CPA obtain documentation and information on how they assessed and validated your hours and experience. (They also happen to require one less audit class than the state I live in)

Has anyone applied for licensure through a state THAT THEY DON’T LIVE IN, and then transferred the license through reciprocity to the STATE THEY DO LIVE IN? It seems legal and allowed, but …. it also feels like gaming the system? Is there any expert I can talk to about this? Even if I have to pay the person? I just want an answer so I know whether this is a valid method, or if I need to start from scratch and get 1800 hours?

[Mike J]

I hear you about others feeling like youre gaming the system.

I'm in NY not Colorado. I still need to gain experience toward the license. But, I feel like others (prospective employers) feel I am gaming the system. I didn't get to 150 credits with an Accounting degree. I have a print journalism degree. But I took 68 Accounting and Business credits to get the individual credit hours necessary for license in NY. I passed the same exams my contemporaries have. I already have a shit ton of debt from my BA and wanted to pay out of pocket just what I need.

However, because of that perception, I've had to matriculate in a Master's program (tax). I'm paying out of pocket still. But I digress.

So, I probably can't help you with your specific issue. But when it comes to gaming the system don't feel bad. You didn't make the laws. But you are very much an accountant. You put in the work. Don't feel bad. You're doing what you need to like me.

[Amanda]

So you ended up getting your master's in tax because of the perception even though it was legal and allowed? I have 150 credits, but it was a bachelor's in accounting with a million starts and stops and changes of majors where I got 150 credits with just an undergrad degree. Congrats on passing all the exams and I hope you get the experience soon. What makes you think employers perceive you as gaming the system?

[Mike J]

Thank you.

It's because they always asked “so when do you graduate?” eventho I clearly identify on top of my accounting classes as prereqs for the exams. Theyd often then say, I thought you needed a bachelor's degree in Accounting to be licensed (eventho New York State outlines the academic requirements by credit hours in specific areas).

Perhaps they think they can't bill me out without a degree in Accounting.

Either way, it just seemed like the conversation would end at that point. eg good for you but you're not what were looking for right now. I mean, I'm also in my late 30s applying for entry level and 1 to 2 year experience jobs.

In a way it works out to be compelled to get a degree, because REG was by far my weakest in terms of conceptually understanding the material.

What were some of your starts and stops?

[Amanda]

Yeah I think most states just require credits in specific accounting classes! You probably have nomre accounting classes than I do even though you don't have the degree. I'm also in my late 30s – was a French major, dropped out, started back later as a nursing major, business major, then finally accounting… took me 18 years to finally graduate. I haven't had problems yet getting jobs, but have only applied for smaller firms and industry, but still the pay is better than some of the entry level positions at big 4, so I guess it's fine.

I'm working on REG now, ugh. I hate tax. Impressed you got your masters in tax. Have you had more luck now?

[Mike J]

Hey, at least you finished!

I may have mispoke. I meant that I matriculated in a MST but don't have it yet. I can only afford one class per semester and am on pace for next Fall to graduate.

I hated tax when going through the prereqs. But VITA helped lift the veil a bit.

I'm still struggling to make inroads. I have a job at a dental insurance company. I don't waste my time on Big 4. That's okay because smaller firms allow you to do more.

[Mike J]

How'd you decide on Accounting?

[Amanda]

Ah, got it. I probably just misunderstood! Did you like doing VITA? I was looking into doing that, just to get more tax experience. I decided on accounting after bombing an intermediate accounting 1 final – I didn't want accounting to defeat me, so I had to defeat it 🙂 But also it just seemed like a stable career, and was similar to what I was doing before (supply chain management), but without as much chaos. How did you decide on it, after journalism?

[Mike J]

I liked VITA because I used it as an opportunity to learn. Yes, the returns for the most part are simple. But, I sought to kind of combine the Link-and-learn materials, CPA review notes and whatever I could find elsewhere. I got a better understanding of retirement income, and schedules B, C, D, E.

Mostly I liked the teaching aspect of it. I wasn't as fast as the other volunteers. They just viewed it as data entry. I took an extra 2 minutes to step them through a 1040. That helped anticipate a lot of their questions. Then I suggested some things to avail themselves of credits and deductions for the next year.

Ultimately I love to teach and I enjoyed the research aspect to being a journalist. But you gotta pay the bills.

[Recked]

I would eat crow and go back to the job you quit.
Gather up as much dirt as you can, just in case your employer continues to refuse to sign off on your verification form.
Seems the long game is the play on this one.

[Amanda]

Are you suggesting to go back over trying to get licensed in a different state? I don't want to go back, because what would make them suddenly act ethical? I refuse to be manipulated like that, and would rather never get licensed than work for someone who isn't truthful. I'd rather start from scratch than go work for someone who isn't truthful. I don't see any benefits to going back – who's to say they'd ever sign off?

[Recked]

If they are unethical or doing illegal things, then you have leverage…
How can they not sign off for you?

[Amanda]

As far as I know, this isn't illegal.

[Mike J]

How can they not signoff? Are you kidding me? The profession, like most others, is run by the owner class. There is nothing really in the law to stop any CPA boss to arbitrarily say that someone isn't ready when they are. They are the gatekeepers and you know it. So they can continue to refuse to signoff.

It sucks but I would just try to start over with a smaller firm. Stress of this kind (going back and somehow hope her bosses will do the right thing when there is no real disincentive for them to not) isn't worth it.

[Amanda]

It Was a small firm, no HR or anything. If I kept working for her, I'm confident she would have signed off because it was a benefit to her. I don't plan to do public accounting so I'd rather apply through another state than start from scratch but who knows, it's frustrating.

[Author]

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