[jeff]

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[Anonymous]

well, the attachment and signature eventually did occur but at a later date. and once the attachment happened, i think that its prior perfection still counts or prevails.

wiley didn't really say attachment MUST occur first, and perfection second.

it seems like one has to occur for the other, but the timing doesn't really matter.

the only thing with wiley is that it doesn't get into specific explanations, and whenever that happens i usually refer somewhere else or just assume if it's not stated in wiley, and the MC supports a presumption that i made then i go with that. hopefully that wouldn't turn out to be big mistakes D:

[Anonymous]

well, the attachment and signature eventually did occur but at a later date. and once the attachment happened, i think that its prior perfection still counts or prevails.

wiley didn't really say attachment MUST occur first, and perfection second.

it seems like one has to occur for the other, but the timing doesn't really matter.

the only thing with wiley is that it doesn't get into specific explanations, and whenever that happens i usually refer somewhere else or just assume if it's not stated in wiley, and the MC supports a presumption that i made then i go with that. hopefully that wouldn't turn out to be big mistakes D:

[Qlad]

Cupcake…i will write the exact explanation…if u understand pls share…I had answered C. for exactly the same reason that u gave above…

Explanation: When there is a conflict between perfected security interests in the same collateral, priority goes to the creditor who was first to either file or perfect, even if perfection is not completed upon filing ( there can never be perfection until there is attachment, attachment did not occur until after the date on which National Bank filed.) Because National Bank filed before Local bank either filed or perfected, Local bank has constructive notice of National Bank's interest.

FAR 72,71,81 🙂
AUD 64,71, 72, 75 🙂 I'm done !!!
REG 73, 74, 74, 84 🙂
BEC 76 🙂

[Qlad]

Cupcake…i will write the exact explanation…if u understand pls share…I had answered C. for exactly the same reason that u gave above…

Explanation: When there is a conflict between perfected security interests in the same collateral, priority goes to the creditor who was first to either file or perfect, even if perfection is not completed upon filing ( there can never be perfection until there is attachment, attachment did not occur until after the date on which National Bank filed.) Because National Bank filed before Local bank either filed or perfected, Local bank has constructive notice of National Bank's interest.

FAR 72,71,81 🙂
AUD 64,71, 72, 75 🙂 I'm done !!!
REG 73, 74, 74, 84 🙂
BEC 76 🙂

[Anonymous]

Okay, very helpful. That is tricky, but I understand now. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Okay, very helpful. That is tricky, but I understand now. Thanks!

[Skrier]

Hey Qlad and others, not sure if this is helpful, but a transaction does not need to be complete to be perfected. The first to file a financing statement is first in line when there are competing financing statements. I deal with UCC's and PMSI filings on a regular basis in my job, and we always make sure we file a financing statement prior to the completing the transaction. The reason for this is when you do a search of financing statements prior to filing yours, you can see if their are other claims on the property you are filing a financing statement against. If there is you still have leverage by not releasing the product, or you can request a subrogation <SP> from your customer meaning that, they would need to request the other party to release their lien so you can be first in line if there is a problem with payment. Therefore the first to file is first in line.

AUD- 84
FAR- 75
REG- 78...I am DONE!!!
BEC- 79

[Skrier]

Hey Qlad and others, not sure if this is helpful, but a transaction does not need to be complete to be perfected. The first to file a financing statement is first in line when there are competing financing statements. I deal with UCC's and PMSI filings on a regular basis in my job, and we always make sure we file a financing statement prior to the completing the transaction. The reason for this is when you do a search of financing statements prior to filing yours, you can see if their are other claims on the property you are filing a financing statement against. If there is you still have leverage by not releasing the product, or you can request a subrogation <SP> from your customer meaning that, they would need to request the other party to release their lien so you can be first in line if there is a problem with payment. Therefore the first to file is first in line.

AUD- 84
FAR- 75
REG- 78...I am DONE!!!
BEC- 79

[stoleway]

@Skrier…Do you file the financing statement even when the debtor has not signed the security agreement?

What if the debtor is no more interested in the loan after filing (remember the debtor hasnt signed up to the agreement yet)

I have passed regulation but Im just curious about this question.

REG -63│ 84!!
BEC- 59│70│ 71 │78!
AUD- 75!
FAR- 87!

Mass-CPA

[stoleway]

@Skrier…Do you file the financing statement even when the debtor has not signed the security agreement?

What if the debtor is no more interested in the loan after filing (remember the debtor hasnt signed up to the agreement yet)

I have passed regulation but Im just curious about this question.

REG -63│ 84!!
BEC- 59│70│ 71 │78!
AUD- 75!
FAR- 87!

Mass-CPA

[Skrier]

@stoleway…by the time I am filing a financing statement, the customers machinery is ready to ship. Our signed contract at the beginning of the project is binding. To file a UCC, the debtor does not need to sign anything. A PMSI on the other hand does require signature and this requires filing prior to finalization of the transaction. Also you would file a UCC filing in addition to the PMSI. Not sure if that answers your question.

AUD- 84
FAR- 75
REG- 78...I am DONE!!!
BEC- 79

[Skrier]

@stoleway…by the time I am filing a financing statement, the customers machinery is ready to ship. Our signed contract at the beginning of the project is binding. To file a UCC, the debtor does not need to sign anything. A PMSI on the other hand does require signature and this requires filing prior to finalization of the transaction. Also you would file a UCC filing in addition to the PMSI. Not sure if that answers your question.

AUD- 84
FAR- 75
REG- 78...I am DONE!!!
BEC- 79

[stoleway]

@Skrier…thanks for the feedback but Im still not clear so I will pick a sentence from your explanation and make a follow up question. “Our signed contract at the beginning of the project is binding”

If I understand this sentence well, does it mean that there has to be somekind of a contractual agreement between you and the customer before the filing can take place?

There has to be a contract prior to filing, right?

REG -63│ 84!!
BEC- 59│70│ 71 │78!
AUD- 75!
FAR- 87!

Mass-CPA

[stoleway]

@Skrier…thanks for the feedback but Im still not clear so I will pick a sentence from your explanation and make a follow up question. “Our signed contract at the beginning of the project is binding”

If I understand this sentence well, does it mean that there has to be somekind of a contractual agreement between you and the customer before the filing can take place?

There has to be a contract prior to filing, right?

REG -63│ 84!!
BEC- 59│70│ 71 │78!
AUD- 75!
FAR- 87!

Mass-CPA

[Skrier]

@stoleway..that is correct. In the example above that Qlad posted, you will notice the debtor did not sign and pick up the funds until after the filing was done. That doesn't mean National Bank assumed the debtor wanted the loan, there must have been some agreement in place prior to the filing, but the signing of the security agreement or I would assume (loan documents) didn't take place until he picked up the money. They secured their interest in the loan prior to finalizing the deal. I am not sure what steps lead up to their filing, but there would have been some sort of agreement in place. Does this make sense?

AUD- 84
FAR- 75
REG- 78...I am DONE!!!
BEC- 79

[Author]

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