[Spur]

Having CPA and passing the CFA Exam is my ultimate goal. Fortunately for me, taking both accounting and finance to get the hours during my undergrad was perfect as I really enjoyed both subjects. Eventually, I would love to also sit for the CFA exam. However, Accounting was always a more structured practice in my mind so that is why I went into that career path. Anyone on this forum have both, pursuing both, or know someone who does?

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[Anonymous]

this sounds like too much work

i do have a couple friends studying for it, one of which is a cpa. both have struggled with it and i believe one just passed level 2 the other has to wait and retake it. i have never looked into it and never will, i have just heard both of them complain about it at random times

[Anonymous]

Its an exam that is going to require similar effort as the CPA. You have to study your butt off just like you have to for the CPA. You're going to be miserable just like you have been during the CPA. However, they offer the test a lot less frequently. I believe if you fail the first part, you have to wait another year to take it. That would be a miserable experience, I imagine (knowing you missed a passing score by a few points and having to keep your memory there for 365 days).

[Spur]

That's very interesting, thanks for the comments so far!

I'd love to hear from those of you who have both. Where are you working now? Did it make a difference on your resume to have both? What was your motivation for getting both? Was getting both your intention or was it a career mandate?

Sorry about all of the questions, but I'm just curious about the though process people went through to get both of these designations and what their post certification experience has been.

Thanks!

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[Mayo]

I'm pursuing both. I'm doing it more for the knowledge I've gained, and I only hope it can open doors in the future.

In terms of how it might help me specifically? It gets a little dicey there because there's very little jobs where having both a CPA and the CFA charter are actually the norm. As an example, if you're in asset management or equity research, you probably started out as a finance person, or transitioned to finance from a good to great MBA or Undergraduate program.

Outside of going to a top rated MBA program, it's difficult to rebrand yourself so you're not seen as an “accounting” person. Personally, I think that's ridiculous. Especially with equity research/security analysis, accounting is such a big part of the job, I don't see how having a CPA is not a huge plus. But it is what it is.

In the Big 4, you can probably be recruited to Valuation from a good MBA or undergrad program. In that case, the CFA and CPA is a pretty useful combo, but definitely not required. You'll most likely see a lot of ASA and CFA combos. Transitioning from audit to valuation is a lot easier at regional firms than it ks at a Big 4 in my opinion.

Finally, passing some parts of the CFA gives you some “non accounting” street cred (haha) if you're ever looking at quasi finance positions like a Financial Analyst and/or Financial Due Diligence. It looks good, but it's not necessarily required. Still, it will impress people.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Spur]

Mayo. thanks for posting. This is exactly the direction I was thinking of taking. I've tried the big 4 route and hated it. I felt so depressed there (it confirmed to me that I can't work at a big company). I think you put it perfectly by saying that the CFA and CPA combo will be good for a quasi finance position.

I already have my MBA (from a mid tier school) and the CPA and CFA I think will also allow usto distinguish ourselves amongst those who just have one or the other. And the knowledge gained from studying for the exam I'm sure won't hurt.

Ok, back to re-studying for FAR. Thanks!

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[Anonymous]

My friend just passed the CFA and got into Duke B-School. It's no joke. I never saw him for months at a time.

I think in my experience, assuming little starting knowledge or as sensei Olinto says it, “You drank your way through college and blacked out and don't remember anything,” it's roughly 600 hours for CPA with a non-accounting background and 900 for CFA. Not to diminish the accomplishment for getting a CPA license, but they offer it 4 times a year, while CFA you can only take twice for level I, and you get 1 shot per year for parts II and III.

Dollar for dollar, the CFA and CPA are the greatest value as they cost less than $5K, carries a lot of weight in the finance world vs a tier 1 MBA at $80-$120K. It will open doors, but having the golden trifecta of tier 1 MBA , CPA, and CFA puts you in the top 1% of finance professionals and will raise eyebrows.

[Spur]

@d3strukt, do you have any supporting info for your claim “but having the golden trifecta of tier 1 MBA , CPA, and CFA puts you in the top 1% of finance professionals”?

I'm sure its up there, but it would be great if you could share your source.

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[Spur]

bump

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[musicamor]

I'm curious about the “golden trifecta” claim as well. How does that set one apart? Are you aware of specific positions that this trifecta would apply?

Texas CPA - licensed in 2012!!!

[Mayo]

I think focusing on the specific designations might be the wrong way of approaching it.

Think about Big 4 recruiting…getting the initial interview rests on a few factors: Prestige/rank of school, gpa, and extracurriculars. Having passed all the exams can be eyebrow-raising and can definitely help a recruit that's on the bubble/margins. However, if other factors are not in place, it is almost meaningless to have those exams passed during that time. Most of the value of the CPA comes from the benchmark signal it sends, the necessity behind it, and the experience you need to get it.

Similarly, passing the CFA by itself, with no relevant experience, is marginally useful, but isn't a golden ticket. The reason is because, again, much of the value comes from getting the experience to get the charter. However, like I mentioned before, it will impress people who know about it and/or have taken it.

Finally, an MBA is as worthwhile as the reputation of the program. If you get it fom a no name school, it won't add nearly as much value initially as the one coming from a top university. Again, this changes over time, and an MBA can add value if combined with good experience.

For example, a staff accountant who has received their CPA, 1 year experience, passed all CFA exams, and has a low-ranked MBA won't get the same benefit as senior accountant who has their CPA, 5 years experience, gotten accepted to a top 25 MBA program, and passed 2 exams. In addition, the Senior has been actively networking for 5 years and has gotten to know the career landscape pretty well. After yer 1 of his MBA is over, he has 5 or 6 people he can contact for summer analyst positions in Consulting, Security Analysis, Equity Research, etc.

My point is, having the designations by themselves adds less value than having them with relevant work experience or being in a good recruiting position (top MBA with a good network).

To be quite honest, a CFA is a pretty narrow designation. Sure it gives you some chops, but people think it helps get you to Investment Banking or Private Equity. Not really. In that case a top MBA is much more valuable and versatile.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Spur]

@Mayo. Thank you for the insightful contribution. That makes a lot of sense.

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[romo86]

Hey Spur – I'm a CFA Candidate and taking the Level III exam this upcoming June (hopefully my last one), and I also started pursuing my CPA License in August of 2012. I've passed three of the CPA exams and will be done with my final one, AUD, on January 22nd.

First, let me be clear that I think both the CPA and CFA are great accomplishments for anyone and neither is superior to the other. Which is better will largely be determined by what you prefer and your personal career goals. I personally believe that it is an incredibly powerful combination of letters to put behind your name, which is why I have chosen to go for both.

To compare and contrast CPA/CFA in terms of difficulty and overall:
– Studying for the CFA exams is not similar to studying for the CPA exams. A good test taker can rely on the Becker materials and get through all the CPA exams in 6 months or less. The CFA curriculum materials can't be simply memorized, because you need to understand and be able to apply financial theory in many different ways.

– In my opinion, as has been said by others, the CFA LI exam is similar in difficulty to all of the CPA exams put together.

– Additionally, you need the four years of qualifying work experience to actually use the letters after passing all three exams. There are very few accounting positions where your work experience will count for both. To pass all of the exams is an accomplishment regardless, but I personally wouldn't go through the misery that's required if I didn't think I'll have the experience to use the letters. If this is important to you, read about work experience requirements on the CFA Institute website.

– Mayo has several things right. To elaborate, there is a reason that very few people have earned both the CPA License and CFA Charter. If you go to the CFA Institute website you will find that there are approximately 97,000 CFA charterholders in more that 130 countries and territories, and over 219,000 exam registrations were received from aspiring charterholders in 2012. Comparatively, there are many more people than that who have their CPA license in the US alone.

-The tests are hard and there is a ton of material to learn. It's that simple. Pass rates can be found on the CFA Institute website, but assuming a 35% pass rate at each level, there are few people who make it to the end. Without adjusting for people that retake the exam at any particular level, only approximately 12% of people who sign up for Level I will pass Level II (35% x 35%). Put another way, the exam and material difficulty go up and you may assume the talent does as well.

– Mayo also mentioned how many people think getting the CFA charter will help them get into IB or Private Equity. The IB groups aren't that interested in CFA charter holders because they are sometimes taught things which go against the grain when it comes to how they do things.

For instance, in an indirect way the CFA curriculum really pushes FCFE/FCFF for valuation and criticizes the use of EV/EBITDA/EBIT multiples; and those multiples are an investment bankers best friend. The idea they pitch is that it's a simpler measurement to attain (sloppy/lazy) and inflates valuations by leaving out various expenses/charges, such as interest/taxes/depreciation/amortization. This is true to a degree, but I personally see it as the academic worlds attack on the practitioners. If you are performing valuations for M&A it makes sense to use the simpler measures depending on the circumstances, because the management decisions made in the past regarding financing sources (interest exp) or fc investments (depreciation) are irrelevant to an acquiring firm that can make decisions going forward as they see fit.

This is just one small example, but the bottom line is if someone doesn't recognize these conflicts they are likely to make life difficult for their supervisors, so in the majority of cases the banks prefer to hire MBAs that they can teach to do things their way. The CFA designation is really more geared toward equity research.

At the end of the day if it is something you really want to pursue, then go for it! In the worst case scenario you learn something new. Just make sure you want it for yourself and not merely because it's the next designation on a list. The exams require far too much work and dedication to be successful if you don't have that inner drive.

Best of luck.

BEC - 85
REG - 75
AUD - TBD
FAR - 82

CFA Level III Candidate (June 2013)

[Spur]

@romo86. Thank you very much for that bit of insight. Good luck to you in your studies!

FAR - Bad Fail '11, Fail '12, Fail '13, PASS It's a miracle!
AUD - Fail, PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BEC - PASS!!!!!!!!
REG - PASS!!!!!!!! And I'm done!

[Greenman72]

I'm with Romo on this one. I'm also a CPA and June 2013 Level 3 Candidate.

I would say that the CPA exam has about the same level of difficulty as the CFA exam. That is, all four parts of CPA are about as difficult as Level 1 of the CFA exam.

Level 2 is probably about 50% harder than Level 1. That's why only 1 out of 3 pass it.

And Level 3 is just as hard as Level 2. It's probably harder, once you consider your fatigue and lack of motivation. That's why half of those who pass Level 2 fail Level 3.

[jeff]

CPA has about a 30% first time pass rate..comparable to Level 2.

[Author]

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