[thedude]

Hello everyone. I have been trolling this forum for a while and read some prettying interesting advice. I would like to thank you all. My question is what is the big obsession working for a Big 4 and working the crazy hours. In other words, is the work put into it worth it now and in the future?

Aud: 42 (ouch)

All others TBD

[Anonymous]

@its That logic can apply to a ton of professions and positions. There are very few truly “irreplaceable” people out there. You can call someone on another team a robot if it makes you feel better. You're still playing the same game.. so what does that make you?

As for the hours argument, that's again something that depends on the person. If you don't like long hours, go work your standard 40 hour job. By all means. It's not like Big 4 tricks anyone. Every firm I talked to made it very clear. Hell, even the smaller firms I talked to made sure that I knew what a busy season was just in case I didn't.

Getting back to the op.. is it worth it? Again, it depends on the person. For you, it may not be. For me, it is.. and it's not because I can drop a fat paycheck on your head or flaunt my shiny promotion. Being a part of an elite network is important to my personal goals and happiness. To someone else, those things are dumb. To each their own.

[Anonymous]

Always think ahead, especially in regards to your career.

I picked a Big 4 because of exit opportunities/brand.

To each, their own.

[Mayo]

@uhart,

IMO, the biggest advantage of working in a small shop (whether that's internal audit, public, etc) is that you have such easy access to decision makers. The main consequence being a (potentially) closer relationship and easier way for quality work to be recognized and rewarded.

Honestly though…this whole comparison is kind of moot in today's environment (YMMV depending on audit/tax and geographic location). A quality candidate can do a few years in a smaller CPA firm and can go Big 4 or stay put. So starting at a smaller firm isn't necessarily the end of the world. If you're looking for a slightly less “corporate” go non-Big 4 to start with. As the economy improves I bet the firms will start contacting YOU (assuming you're on linkedin).

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Anonymous]

I have not yet landed an accounting gig after passing the CPA but I have been relatively successful in my other career over the last 10 years.

Here is my general observations about companies (not specific to CPA Firms):

Big companies are good but you need to fit into a job mold more. It is more of an assembly line and you may have less influence to improve the organization with your efforts. I am guessing that in Big4 you are spending a lot of time in your first years doing a lot of manual data entry or reviewing .pdf documents–jobs that don't require much thought but that need to be done in order to complete taxes/audits of these mega corporations.

Small companies would seem to need you to wear more hats out of necessity. You can't specialize in audit or tax..you have to do both. You will need to meet with decision makers of small companies out of necessity.

[Anonymous]

It's all about the exit opportunities.

A ‘good' student getting a job at a big 4, working there for 1-4 years and then hitting the job market is going to have more opportunities available to them than an ‘outstanding' student who chose to go to a tiny firm for 1-4 years. Fair or not, it is just the way it is. With that said, people leaving smaller firms will have certain advantages over big 4 dropouts for certain positions as well – they'll just be more specialized and probably at smaller companies.

I also think that there is not a HUGE difference between big 4, international and large regional. As long as you get that public accounting and SOX experience (which you are more likely to get at big 4), then you can advertise as such on your resume and linkedin and you'll have doors open up for you.

[taxman89]

I work in a large corp (fortune 200) and have not worked for a big 4 but here is my experience. I started in industry and got paid about 20% more than entry level big 4 (its about 33% more if you have a masters degree + 0 exp). However, 1 yr exp in a big 4 is worth about 1.5 yrs in industry (even internal years). We have a guy who started here right after getting his masters 5 years ago. he is one step below manager (there are 4 steps below manager). We just hired a manager (different area of tax than the other guy) from a big 4 with 5 years exp there and she is a manager. both people are excellent and both have 5 years exp but the big 4 exp is worth more. This might not be how it is everywhere but i would imagine that the main benefit of big 4 (if you dont want to shoot for partner) is the exit opportunities. THe manager is now 5 years into her career and prolly making 6 figures with bonuses.

Aud-75 3x I knew i never liked you
Bec-77 1x being in the bubble is stressful
Reg-82 4x its not me its you...and no we cant be friends
Far-78 1x easiest section

[Anonymous]

Just to give you an idea. Right now I am looking for a new opportunity and I have not had the fortune of working in the big 4 I do have public experience from a medium size firm.

Most of the job postings I have seen esp for companies that make up fortune 100 do say big 4 preferred.

So having big 4 does help give you that extra leverage but if you don't doesn't mean you won't get into a good company. It just is a bit harder.

[Vlakmir]

I'm starting big 4 next month. I've had 3 internships, one at the big 4.

My 2 internships not at the big 4 gave me lots of variety – Some tax, some audit, research, etc…

My internship at the big 4 was all audit, private companies.

One advantage is that specializing can make you useful later. I chose private companies because you get to do all parts of the statements/controls, while many people on public clients spend their days tying numbers to press releases / auditing cash for 6 months. Sound terrible. I figured big 4 + Non-public would give me decent variety + options to help in private tax services + Big 4 name. My friend that I met interning did Large public companies was so bewildered why I would come to the big 4 and want to do private companies only – And now he's trying to get into my department after days and days of min numbing work, while I worked on 6 different clients in 7 weeks.

Everyone seems to complain about the long hours, and I'm sure I'm ignorant as my experience as an intern was super easy (they do that on purpose, I know).

One thing I did notice though, was almost every one of my colleagues had never had a job before. Most of them were always tired and complaining about working 8 hour days. Add another 2 hours or so a day and you can see how bad it can be at times. Me, on the other hand, thought it was a joke. As I've had a thousand jobs since I was 12.

According to a lot of people, you get worked to death. But there were a fair number of people that had control over their schedules, and could “work from home” here and there (which they made it seem like, I busted my ass last week, I'm taking friday off and “working” from home)

Deloitte released a study saying that some insanely high % of people quit Big 4 without using their vacation time.

So, a bunch of people that don't know how to schedule their vacation times, don't know how to negotiate or say no to zealous managers, have never worked in their lives before, are all complaining that working at a big 4 sucks. You have to factor these in when you hear the horror stories.

I am viewing my job as a path to something else. The only reason I would stay until manager is if I really like it. However, odds are I will simply take a decent exit opportunity and view the first few years of my career as “doing my time” (which isn't uncommon in most careers).

I also think you should know that many people working at a big 4 aren't very smart. It's insane how well you can do in school while being so bad in the workplace. If you're doing things at 75% speed, shit is going to take a lot longer…

In the end, If you have the chance to go Big 4 – do it for the resume line item. You'll definitely learn. I'm doing private company stuff, so it's really messy, but I'm excited to get some real experience on seeing how successful businesses develop and account for their stuff. You should view it as a learning opportunity, not a boring job.

Oh, and also you get a $5000 bonus for passing the exam within one year of your start date.

Another thing about the big 4- your team can make or break your experience. Incompetent managers+assshats to work with = Lots of work. Smart manager with fun people = considerably less work.

Really though, if you are scared of working hard at the start of your career, it seems like a terrible reason to not go for a big ticket item. The line item helps, trust me. Even my internship there led to other internships and other opportunities.

If you make it, treat it as a time to learn and grow your network. Stay if you like it, leave with your new opportunities if you don't. But to not go to a big 4 because of some crap you read on the internet? That's a poor move. And if you're scared of working hard? Everyone feels that when starting a (even new) career.

REG - 92
AUD - 90
BEC - 82
FAR - 82
BISK Review Materials
DONE! /Happydance

[Author]

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