[I just love this]

Hey everyone, just joined.

Question for everyone: The Big Four Firms- What are your opinions on the differences in their culture, priorities, public impressions about the firm, etc ?

I’m very curious as an upcoming accounting professional.

REG- Waiting 7/1/13
BEC- Waiting 7/23/13
AUD- Studying 8/12/13
FAR- Signed up 10/1/13
Studying with CPAExcel and Wiley Test Bank.

[Anonymous]

Big 4 Culture can be summarized as follows.

1) Time off? What's that?

2) Family? Oh yeah, I see them sleeping late at night when I come back from work each day.

3) A heart attack is no excuse for you not to at least check your e-mails on your blackberry, you lazy lout.

4) Welcome to the company. You will now be worked to death until you decide to quit the job.

5) Holidays mean you can go home after 8 hours of work.

[Anonymous]

I’m going to go ahead and disagree with the bit of hyperbole spun by brobkorz.

I work for a Big 4 now and in the day-to-day micro sense, I can say the culture largely depends on the type of engagement you’re placed on. You can have relaxed/helpful/happy/constructive managers & Seniors or you can have moody/condescending/intimidating managers & Seniors. It really all depends.

But in the macro sense, the Big 4 culture has its ups and downs. There are certainly politics in the sense that reputations can quickly be formed and spread, but while that may sound like a negative, it can also be a positive if you have the reputation for being likable and good at your job. This would allow you to bet on the better engagements.

I don’t like when people in this forum come out with these blanket, extreme statements like “What hours do you works? LOL – what hours DON’T you work?!?!?”

The Big 4 remains an excellent place to start one’s career. Unfortunately, I wasted my time in smaller firms for a few years after college and had to scratch and claw my way into my current firm. Recruiters and companies would barely sniff my weak resume….but hopefully that will change in the ensuing years as I have more marketable experience. I would advice any college student who has public accounting ambitions to attempt to begin that path in a Big 4 firm. Chances are you won’t stay there forever, but it’s the ideal place to start, in my opinion.

Also in my previous, smaller local firms, I never had my own laptop, or training, or 5 weeks PTO, or the opportunity to travel to other cities for clients, or even coffee (yes at one very small firm I had a short stint at, coffee was not provided – however I think this is an extreme case and certainly not the norm). So I appreciate everything my Big 4 firm gives me now.

[Anonymous]

“5) Holidays mean you can go home after 8 hours of work.”

Do you know this from personal experience? I have yet to work a holiday.

[Anonymous]

“Do you know this from personal experience? I have yet to work a holiday. “

Not from personal experience, just people who complained about working at Big4.

You can read lots of threads here alone about this.

[Mayo]

I think when people complain about their jobs you have to take it with a grain of salt.

It can definitely get bad if you're stuck on a bad team or client, but people have a tendency to sometimes exaggerate for effect.

Truth is, public accounting equals more hours than industry regardless if in a small or big firm.

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Anonymous]

You guys say it like it is a bad thing. The hours that is. It is. But at the same time, I bet you secretly you wear it with as much pride as a gold badge. I would too honestly. A majority of people in this forum is ambitious. And very few have the chance to work long hours with great talent.

[Anonymous]

I've been out of the Big 5 (now 4) world for awhile now, but I would say that KPMG has the lowest public perception rating of the Big 4.

I worked so many hours one week during busy season to wrap up an engagement for a huge global company that I feel asleep at the wheel and was in a car accident. I told the senior on my engagement long about 1:30 am that I was super tired and needed to go home, and she basically told me that if I left before everyone else I would get a terrible rating. That's when I decided my life was more important than a company name on my resume.

[Anonymous]

@apbandj – That is awful!

I still don't understand the lure of working for one of the Big 4. From what I've read and what my boss has told me, I don't think I would ever want to work in that kind of environment. Of course, that is a personal choice, and not meant to offend anyone. During my last semester in college I had to interview with three companies as a graduation requirement. One of my interviews was with one of the Big 4. I told him at the beginning of the interview that I had no desire to work for him but I was required to interview. He said he respected my opinion and we talked about fishing for 15 minutes.

[Peanut]

Whoops, I posted this in the other thread, for some reason I thought we were consolidating ha

@CA_Future_CPA_1222, thank you for putting a positive spin on things. I start at a Big 4 in Boston in September. The biggest complaint I hear is the hours. I've already worked for a company that was 60+ hours a week. To me, I am young and I should be working these crazy hours !! Not when I'm married and have children. I want to get this crazy/work life balance out of my system now while I am young. I also hear that everything really depends on the type of engagement you're put on.

AUD 81 (X4) Previous scores 59, 72, 72
REG 80 (X3) Previous scores 59, 60
FAR 75 (X2) Previous score 67
BEC 79 (X2) Previous score 58

[I just love this]

Thanks for the feedback,

@Kricket- that is hilarious, and an interesting graduation requirement.

From my limited perspective (having not yet worked for a Big 4 but will be interning very soon), it seems the hours of the Big 4 can be explained (other than the billable hour model) because the Big 4 know they (arguably) are the best place to start a career in accounting, so they will always have talent applying. They know most people will leave in 2-5 years, so they just burn everyone out since they'll be leaving anyways. The Big 4 model makes complete sense to me, not sure if y'all would agree or not with that theory.

Maybe I could have worded my original question better, I'm wondering what are the different overarching perceptions of the specific Big 4 firm's personalities. Just wanted to get ideas from others.

Based on my limited observation:

KPMG- Bottom of the big 4, more laid back, more easy going, larger in the UK & Internationally than US.

PwC- Very smart hires, in my experience a definite feel of pride in the firm, even elitism/arrogance.

E&Y- Don't know enough to form an opinion, except that a HR staff lied to me once.

Deloitte- Very top notch firm, lots of internal competition among employees.

Anyone agree/disagree with this? Anything you would add?

REG- Waiting 7/1/13
BEC- Waiting 7/23/13
AUD- Studying 8/12/13
FAR- Signed up 10/1/13
Studying with CPAExcel and Wiley Test Bank.

[Anonymous]

@Peanut – no problem. Pretty soon you’ll be able to form your opinion on the Big 4 based off of personal experience. I’m sure everyone will want to hear what you have to say. I was in small firms for 3 years and wanted to play with the big boys so badly. It isn’t always fun, but I’ve learned more in a year here than I did with all my other jobs combined. I’m sorry to read about your AUD experience. AUD too is my last exam and I take it in 5 days. No me gusta.

@ I just love this – Let me ask this…..Say a recruiter or potential employer looks at two resumes, one with KPMG and one with PWC. Each has 4 years of experience. Each has SEC, SOX, private company, diversified industry experience, etc. Does one look better than the other? If so, why?

I think KPMG is last in domestic gross revenue and that’s the reason people want to place it last. I have friends at all 4 firms and it seems that the culture is generally the same across the board. I could be wrong and I’m very curious to see if someone can prove how one firm’s culture differs from another. I think it also depends on what city you’re in as E&Y Los Angeles would be much different than E&Y Nashviille. But I think all four firms have arrogant, elitist people….all 4 firms have laid back, easy going people, etc. I really think the Big 4 experience comes down to what engagements you’re placed on and how good of a relationship you have with your Performance Manager.

[Anonymous]

@Peanut & @ I just love this – I agree with you both on the hours. It’s the nature of the Big 4 beast. It’s a perfect model for them to make money and we all just have to accept it or don’t. Some weeks I had to work until 1 am each night. Then the next week I was given two days off that didn’t count toward my PTO and worked until 5 pm the other three days as a sort of reward for working so hard. The lifestyle definitely isn’t geared towards a family man/woman with 3 kids, but I believe we all know that.

[Mayo]

From what I've seen personally:

KPMG – I agree with the laid back perception. They work hard and party harder.

PWC – Not much here. Except that I haven't liked a lot of people I've met from the firm. Also, I heard they were sort of deceptive when it came to layoffs. Basically, they said “no layoffs ever” , then laid a bunch of people off.

EY – Good firm. Really focusing on the global aspect. Slowly building their advisory service lines, but no as aggressive as Deloitte.

Deloitte – This firm impresses me the most. They just finished building Deloitte University, a self contained housing/training center, and have been aggressively building their advisory practices. I get the feeling tey are trying hard to be the next Arthur Andersen (pre Enron).

Mayo, BBA, Macc

[Anonymous]

Big 4 culture can be summed up in two words… Indentured Servitude. When you sign on with them you are saying, “In exchange for abusing the crap out of me and maximizing your profits at the cost of my well being, you will open the door for me to get a DECENT job by letting me list you on my resume.”

If you take a $50k a year starting salary / 50 hours on avg a week, you would be comparable to an hourly employee that makes $17.50 an hour working those same hours. They are the last bastion of unethical labor abuse. The kind of people who would have 8 year olds cobbling shoes in a 19th century factory if they thought they could get away with it.

Think of being employed there like a doctor doing their residency, you work there for the experience then you get a REAL job. And FYI, there are other paths to a successful accounting career. Although they seem to have brainwashed most accounting grads to think otherwise.

[I just love this]

I agree there are some universities that really push their graduates to work at the Big 4, however, my university is not one of them. My university focuses on career development in whichever direction you choose to go into.

I am well aware of the amount of hours and work the Big 4 require. In fact when I compare the amount of hours per week I spend into studies, my 2 part-time jobs, and other obligations such as volunteer work, I believe working at the Big 4 would actually be a cut in hours per week (with the exception of the heavy busy season perhaps).

Knowing my work ethic and lack of a sense of entitlement, I'm completely confident the average 50+ hour “indentured servitude” won't be that bad. It's interesting to me how many have this expectation of being entitled to a six figure, 30-hour a week job right out of college or a couple years thereafter, keep dreaming!

REG- Waiting 7/1/13
BEC- Waiting 7/23/13
AUD- Studying 8/12/13
FAR- Signed up 10/1/13
Studying with CPAExcel and Wiley Test Bank.

[Author]

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